Hi Miguel
Yes. I do sense some of it…only you can vouch for all of it of course…
And it is far from easy…it is arduous. I liken it to walking along the edge of a knife sometimes…to be true can hurt. Love can hurt. But still…the edge of that knife keeps one alert. And when alert…consciousness is bound to expand…
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Because the more i belive in it the more love and attention i recieve from…my father…
I want to love him,but hes like a wall,he doesnt want really…
Every time i go to him and i talk to him from my hearth…he dont listen,he use to stop the conversation,put the tv and put the volume more loud.He says im an overly dramatic person,like psiquiry diagnosed to me two years ago.
Its really hard katrine,you dont know how really hard is being ignored of this way by a family member.Thats why i feel lot of pain,frustation,anger,hate…inside
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I grew up being beaten… years and years of it… from the age of 4, Miguel. I also had to watch my sisters being beaten. The use of religious terminology to “conform” …was prevalent. And I too loved and hated. I too wanted to be accepted… A’s and diplomas and prizes…none of it brought permanent love…years and years of pain…but somehow…“Evigheten” (“Eternity”…it is what i called the place inside where noone could touch me).
Today…it is seen that the hardship of those times…and all the wonderful exposure to music, literature and artistic expressions in general that my parents exposed me to…without these…I would not be here communing with you today, Miguel. I moved away from home when i was 18. But it took many years to transcend the negative impact of my childhood. But meditation was magic from day one (I was app. 23 then) Everything is connected. Nothing happens to no avail. It is not one thing that brings one home to oneself. It is all of it.
So even if it is hard…don’t lose heart.
This too shall pass…and we live one precious moment at a time
Hey Miguel,
We’re all in the same place…
At some point we have to break free. Now that I’m a parent, I can see my own father with a whole new perspective. Putting the metaphysics of karma to one side, I can see that he grew up with a father who was mentally scarred by World War One. He passed it on as anger and depression, and in turn it was passed down to me. And sometimes I catch myself starting to repeat the same patterns with my own children, and I stop myself and think, “whoa, that war happened 90 years ago, two generations back. It’s stopping here. The misery, the accumulated suffering, it’s ending here, with me.”
There’s a lot of forgiveness that needs to be dished out - not showily or emotionally. But inside. I don’t need my parents to know I’ve forgiven them. I don’t even need them to know that they might have been in need of forgiveness. It doesn’t matter to me any more. Every day I’m breaking the handed-down patterns of behaviour, because otherwise, how long would they be perpetuated? Another generation? Two? Hundreds of years of inexplicable family anguish, the source long forgotten? I really love my father, I cherish all the ways in which he was and is a fantastic dad, and I set aside (not deny or ignore) the not so good stuff. Philip Larkin, the English poet, said: “Man hands on misery to man/It deepens like a coastal shelf.” If we wake up and see the truth in this, see that it’s happening to us, we can change it within ourselves. Turn that miserable statement into “Beings hand on love to beings” - this is something we can do!
Love!
Yes Carson,is like an onion you know,religious beliefs were planted in the most inner layer.Just at the time when you are a child and you keep all you recieve like a sponge.
The rest of the layers are added after and put above that first layers.I think when you (we) say we relearned,maybe werent we putting there other thoughts above the old toughts like a wall? Arent still that thoughts inside that wall we created?
I think this is the real solution.Inquiry. And thats one of the reasons why i (we…) am here.
Katrine,
Since two months,more or less i think…i have been listening sometimes that inner voice…is like i feeling that come sudenly and sometimes…is a feeling of great hope…and it began to appear two months ago…
And the feeling is always traslated in my mind every tie i feel it a automatically like the words
“Keep the faith”. Always the same words come to mind after feeling it.
I only can believe that feelings…because i think its divine helping hand in this moments…
On the other hand,after that i look always around me and think…i cant belive or imagine the way this all will pass,i cant imagine how and where ill find my place in the world…
Beautiful Miguel.
When the discomfort is at it’s max, something inside is stirring and wanting to get out. My suggestion, I know you overload on Samyama, so don’t do samyama, but after meditation, just take the unrest your “mind” is creating on 'i cant belive or imagine the way this all will pass,i cant imagine how and where ill find my place in the world…" and give it to your ishta… the part of you that is saying “Keep the faith”.… the silence. This is a form of self inquiry/samyama blend that I have found very useful in my path.
Hummm…
i understand what you say with giving the words “i cant belive or imagine the way …” to my ishta.
That words come from the mind.
But i dont understand your suggestion about “keep the faith”…just pick it softly sometimes with the mind along the day and let it go in to stillness?
The words “keep the faith” come here from inside very fews time,but since two months i have felt it repeated times,from inside.The words come and i feel great joy and hope.But i cant control this thing that happens,it comes spontaneously…so,i dont understand very well the exercice you talk about…sorry…
And i can only relate it to bhakti yoga (ishta) and samyama (silence).Which is the inquiry component?
Thank you very much,only some confusion here…
and i must say,that the words “i cant imagine the way…” come here just and only after the inner voice “keep the faith”,cz the mind cant imagine how inner silence still believes in a good future for me…its a reaction from the mind as an answer/question to the inner voice
And one strange thing shanti,yesterday during my meditation (only a couple of minutes ) and my rest time after meditation i felt the need of doing some samyama,i “thought” it would help…
Is samyama more powerful than dm? could i add some ssamyma without risk to my sadhanna?
that inner voice is like aotomatic samyama,very good feelings come suddenly from inside to surface,and my mind answer to them with the aoutomatic thought “keep the faith” and after it there appear the second “voice” which says that is impossible to be happy again.
Hi Miguel,
Sorry for the confusion.
When I said: and give it to your ishta… the part of you that is saying “Keep the faith”… the silence.
I was saying, give your worries to your ishta. Your ishta no matter what people call it is the “silence”… and it is from the silence that the words “keep the faith” arises. So all in all, ishta, silence, the place from where the words "keep faith"arise are all the same. Does this help?
Also, during relational self inquiry the answers come from the silence. Hence a form of self inquiry is to ask a question a let it go and let the answer come to you from within. In this case, I use the technique of samyama to get this. So when something is bothering me, I ask the question and let it go in silence, and the answer comes to me. It is not always the way the mind thinks it should be, so over time I have learnt to stop looking for the answers. It comes in the strangest ways, a technique, a book, a post at the forum, words I hear from someone, something I see, hear, say, experience… the list is endless.
That is how you use the samyama technique for self inquiry. Does this help?
PS: We cross posted.
If you’d like to try samyama, then yes go for it. Start with one round of the sutras. Some people find it too powerful, and since you are sensitive, maybe start cautiously. If it seems too powerful, start with the first 3 sutras one round, if that too is too strong start with just “love”.
And yes, your inner silence tells you to “keep the faith”, and the next second your mind jumps in and says… “but that is impossible”. That is normal. See if this topic helps you Mind Filters…
thank you very much shanti,i can try samyama next monthmaybe doesnt it? im adding one minute per month.Now i do 6 mtes dm,and next month i can try with one round of the sutras instead of 1 minute more of dm.
I feel atraction for samyama practice lately,dont know,but something is arising here,is a feeling related to hearth…
thanks for the link
You don’t need to find a right question… take the unrest and give it to god/silence/ishta… take the mind’s doubt “i cant belive or imagine the way this all will pass,i cant imagine how and where ill find my place in the world…” and drop it in silence. Give it to god/silence/ishta.
Thanks shanti,im doing the pratice of asking and letting it go and im really surprised.
Each time that negative thought came,for example:
“Im living a bad situation” - then i identify this toght and let it go in to stillness,and it disapear slowly…
Also i asked “how can get free from all that toughts” and let it go…
And then,after a minutes,when i have forgotten the questions and the toughts,some extatic flasshes came,only two or three in half an hour…
I mde aother questions and let other thoughts go in to stillness…
And i clearly percieve the proces:
I let it go in to stillness (the thoughts or the qiestions),then after a while i experience some extatic flashes of bliss (two or three per half an hour) and as a result of that flashes i begin to feel very good feelings in body and mind…and after that i hear that pure inner voice…i have heard it again twice now…and different words: “you are returning hoome,you are healing your hearth,this is your real place,you need to find hapiness here” or “all is in the mind,your hearth is here” or “follow your desires,your hearth,your father is your father,you are you”
I think the most important thing here is to let go in to stillness something RELATED with that pain,problem…i dont know how to explain it in a right way…The most important thing is the leting go in to stillness,not the question doesnt it? because the question you ask,no matter if its the right or wrong question,the important thing is that is the question you HAVE to ask right now…and this first question always lead you to another question after the answer of inner silence…doesnt it? am i right?
wow
PS-Its amazing,i have and ayp forum inside also
Wonderful. Yes you get it. The question does not matter. The mind does not know. So better to let the silence guide you. The flashes you get are the inner knowing, you don’t have to have an answer the mind understands, if you let go, there is an inner knowing that is hard to put in words… but there is peace inside. Then you know that you have an answer from within.
You do have to have access to some inner silence for this to work tho (which you have plenty of). And Miguel, do self pace… we don’t want you to overload on self inquiry now.
Here is another topic that may interest you. Read the whole thread… there are some really good posts by Yogani in that thread explaining how samyama works: Something to try…
And another technique that you may find interesting: Drop till “You” Drop.
Hi Miguel and Shanti
Thank you for that exchange of posts…it was delightful to read
Miguel…nothing to add to what Shanti has already said…it is wonderful that you are open to receive the “letting go”
Only one comment: Here…a year or two back…because of the need for self-pacing…I tried Samyama with only the sutra “love”. It was not a good idea (sorry Shanti…not to oppose you…but this was the experience here at the time ) “Love” by itself…swept me away on huge ecstatic waves…I overloaded immediately. So…when sensitive…it is good to balance the sutras. So 3 at a time is better. One can also consider saying all 9 sutras…and instead of 15 seconds…there can be a shorter gap between them.
Miguel…I’m so glad you have found a new key
And I absolutely love this:
Hi katrine,
When you tried samyama with love,did you do only for 15 seconds or 5 mtes picking up the word love each fifteen seconds?
45 seconds twice a day (3 sutras) is a reasonable amount for sensitive meditators?
Thanks
