I fear that my wife is completely uncapable of being a tantric partner. She is very sexually damaged I fear. She doesn’t even know this though because she blocked her entire childhood memories from her mind. I think that she has been taken advantage of, has been abused, has been forced and much more, maybe worse sexual experiences and I think that these experiences have created a terrible subconscious sexual identity and sexual preferences for her. It took me a long time to get her to allow ME to make her have an orgasm because she felt she wasn’t worth it and sex was meant for me to enjoy only. A lot of this has been dropped over the years, but I’m sure there are still a lot of subconscious issues under the surface here. Meeting her halfway is more lie me allowing her to have full control. And if she has full control she will not attain any pleasure and will focus purely on me as this is all she knew up until the time we started dating. This is sad I know but this is the reality of my situation.
Yes, I too am going to try what emc suggested and see if this starts the “therapy” ball rolling.
Yes, I have done this as well. Last month I allowed her to make me have a full external orgasm, but this time is what caused me to decide to stay pre-orgasmic from now on. It was terrible. It made her feel good about herself, but the detriment to my energy (both spiritual and physical) was more then I wish to ever go through again. Staying pre-orgasmic is the only way for me right now. Hopefully this too shall pass, but who knows for sure. Thank you for your thoughtful and detailed reply. Muchly appreciated.
Love,
Carson
I find this very revealing and very accurate. I have had to get used to the fact that my wife has no desire to be satisfied physically herself (despite her not being yogic or tantric or whatever) and have had to come to grips with other ways of satisfying her. excpet that the only way SHE seems to be satisfied is by making ME have an external orgasm. Pretty hypocritical if you think about it. But I don’t want to say that because I know that there are other underlying issues as well. Any advice on a not-so harsh way of showing this to her?
Glad YOU trust that I will find the right solution! Not so sure I do yet, haha. Thans again for the thoughtful advice.
Love,
Carson
Hi Carson,
Sounds like your wife may have her own validation tied to giving you an orgasm.
It’s a lot to ask to have her read a book. She may actually have a fear of intimacy also (many of us do). It’s good to spend time being close without sex also.
Here is a much easier beginning; have her watch this youtube clip:
Healing with Sexual Relationships: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NliPruvbhHA
It explains the scientific reasoning behind tantra.
Hi etherfish,
Unfortunately I have no way of watching youtube videos. (neither does she) But I appreciate the effort in providing the link all the same…
We have no issues with not being close emotionally, and no issues with needing sex to feel close or loving or whatever, but what I fear now is that we AREN’T having sex because she won’t insigate it because she hates that I don’t orgasm and I am not initiating sex because I know that she hates me not having an orgasm. And yes, I’m sure she has her own validation tied to giving me an orgasm and I fear this is tied subconsiously to abuse she may have suffered during childhood. But how do I help her break that association? Other then by watching a youtube video? haha.
Love,
Carson
Hey Carson,
I see more of what you’re saying now, and agree with you.
Here’s another way to think about the situation:
If she gets no pleasure from orgasm, and you don’t want to orgasm, and your relationship is fine…then why not actually go full out celibate?
I have found that the sexual energy is much better that way. Stronger, clearer, more grounded.
Just an idea.
Hey Carson,
Sorry if my answer is off-topic but so many mails already in this thread that I cannot read right now.
i’ve had the same problem with my wife a few years ago and as you’ve found out, it happens to many couples so i’ll share here how I did solve the issue with my wife having in mind it almost split us at some point.
Most man don’t know they can have non-ejac orgasm but also most woman don’t know this. My wife was convinced that I need to ejac to have pleasure so she was very destabilized but i kept telling her it was my business in how I orgasm, not hers so she should trust me.
She finally accepted this but we got another problem: I could not ride pre-orgasm waves a very long time while we made love because it would hurt her vagina for some reason but also would bring her nausea. The reason i’ve found out later is that some shaktipat is raised from your vessel & start burning karma in her vessel bringing many symptoms she can’t manage consciously because she was not interested into studying mysticism.
Through time, we were able to make love longer times so shakti took care of her vessel in mysterious ways but I always manage riding pre-orgasm she could handle then non-ejac orgasm.
If I were you, shorter time of pre-orgasm then ALWAYS have orgasm because non-ejac orgasm will fix more things between you and your wife.
Hope this helps, Albert
Hey Carson,
How could you not watch youtube - doesn’t it play when you click the link? I used to watch even with dial-up. As soon as it starts to play, click “pause” and do something else while it loads, then it will play without stopping.
But maybe you don’t have sound.
The video is from this site: http://www.reuniting.info/
It talks about how we are hormonally built to not be monogamous, because being promiscuous is better for survival of the human race.
The way it works is when we are sexually attracted, it raises our dopamine level in the limbic system of our brain. this is the most primitive part of our brain. This is the same thing that happens with addictive drugs. We like the feeling so much we seek it out.
When we have an orgasm, the dopamine peaks much stronger than normal levels. But this peak is followed by a dive in the level which goes up and down erratically for up to two weeks, all the while BELOW normal levels, as a result of the orgasm.
This causes couples who have just had sex to not get along as well afterwords for up to two weeks.
It results in all kinds of alienating feelings until dopamine levels return to normal. Every time they have orgasms, there is the peak followed by lows.
If a couple is pre-orgasmic, their dopamine levels follow more of a sine wave, gently rising up and down with no peak and no crash to low levels.
not only this, but another hormone is generated, oxytocin, the “cuddle hormone”. This is what makes you feel good when you cuddle, and makes people want to be close.
So learning to stay with pre-orgasmic sex will cause a couple to be much more in love, and much more in harmony with each other, because they never reach that dopamine crash that makes them argue, and there is much more oxytocin, an added benefit that makes them feel good when they hold each other.
The video says it better, but that’s the best I can do.
The problem with me having orgasm is my relationship with the Source suffers. If I don’t have an orgasm then my relationship suffers. Which would YOU choose? Man or God? Short term satisfaction or eternal peace? The answer for ME is easy. And I DO have some serious energy loss with orgasm. And you can’t tell me I don’t.
Love,
Carson
I’m really trying to avoid having orgasms at all. I feel MUCH better when I don’t. I lose so much energy even with blocked orgasms. I know everyone is not like this, and I probably won’t be forever either, but it definitely is like this for me right now.
Love,
Carson
I can’t watch youtube videos at home because the only computer I have at home that works now is a Mac G4 that has always been dedicated to my recording studio and has some software on it that cannot be upgraded without spending many thousands of dollars and this means I have to run OS 9.2.2. Which does not support many websites these days. I’m lucky I can still get AYP! I can’t even check my email on this computer. And the computer I use at work has a “smartfilter” on it and youtube is blocked.
Thanks for the explanation! I have heard of many studies like this, many of which state that we can no longer “get high” (on dopamine) from our partners after I think the timeframe was 7 years. That statistic combined with what you are saying should be more then enough to convince ANYONE to stay pre-orgasmic! haha. I will have my wife read what you wrote or have her check out the website in the morning. Thank you again for all your advice and thoughtful suggestions.
Love,
Carson
Hi Carzon,I agree with Etherfish. Marnia Robinson writes a lot about this on www.reuniting.info. Check that site out!
It seems as if this orgasm thing can start off a pretty deep work in your wife! If she has been sexually abused, as you strongly believe (or know), then she has a lot of layers to go through!
I think you are on the right track with her, the way you meet her needs! She has to slowly gain trust in a sexual situation again, and losen her conditionings. That can take a long time! You are actually helping her A LOT by taking this subject to discussion - by that you are breaking her conditioned response to only have any self-worth through satisfying a man by giving him an orgasm. I see much more of the picture now, from what you’ve told, and this has been the area of my research work for 12 years, so trust me, I know what I’m talking about! I wrote my thesis on the importance of a partner for sexual abuse survivors.
It is a shaky period for her, I’m sure. All her stability is in keeping things as they were. When things start to change, she will have to start facing her worst parts of the psyche. It takes a great deal of patience and understanding from the partner, and you seem to have it! She is lucky!
If I were you, I’d sort of start from the beginning with “sex”. What is sex for you? Is it only a full penetration? For me, sex is being intimate physically in all possible ways. What if you back a few steps and just start to do a lot of caressing? Just being naked with eachother and explore the whole bodies, as if it was the first time you were to touch it, with hands, mouth… whatever! That can be a difficult thing!!! It can bring up masses of bodily shame and discomfort, then that is what has to be attended to first. If you get into it though, it can bring tremendous relaxation (oxytocin being released, same hormone that releases during meditation), sensuality awakening, and building trust. Just carressing that way can bring a couple together in intimacy again. Arousal can come and go in such situation. It will be a first step for her to practice RECEIVING, which seems to be her problem. Many victims of abuse have great problems being sensually touched. If she has a lot of bodily blockages that will be tough for her, and she might get memories of abuse etc. Then just let her control it fully and let her be able to stop it anytime. And most important: If she gets emotional in that situation - just hold her! Hold her in stillness and BE there for her! It’s the greatest gift you can give! I’ve gotten reports from many male friends who have started to do this with their girlfriends, and they say “She just starts to cry and cry when I just hold her”. That’s the way it works. When the man is truly not sexually WANTING in a situation like that, but truly unselfish and attending her needs, which obviously is NOT you having an orgasm (=keeping the abuse patterns intact for psychological stability), but to release those nightmares in a safe environment, then miracles can take place!!! Healing of tremendous proportions can take place! A woman wants to be Loved and cleansed from the old abusive sexuality. You can help her with that!
Hi Carson,
Does your wife masturbates ?
If yes, does she accept to do it in front of you ?
Which “kama sutra” or “position” your wife accepts to a reach an orgasm when you touch her ?
I also suggest you shift to tantric mirror technique of the all situation: you prefer to not orgasm to not dissolve a wound in you and she wants you to orgasm to avoid her sexual abuse memory. In other words, she reflects a blockage in you and you reflect a blockage in your wife. The approach would be for you to energy work in solo-tantra both aspects (internal & external).
In Shakti, Albert
Hi Carson,
You posted the above quote in response to Michael. This is a very interesting subject by the way.
The way I see it, your own purification and opening is bond to spread to the world around you, first affecting the ones closer to you, in turn finding blocks and bringing in a need to more openings. It seems to me you have a clear and sober view on things and you are reasoning well (“the force (inner silence) is strong in you Luke!” ). In my opinion it won’t help if you compromise to her need for you to have an orgasm because, even if that brings immediate relief to her suffering of the idea she is not satisfying you, it is not, in the long term, solving anything. As you put it, there are issues she seems to have to deal with and I believe you can help her do that if she is willing to try.
So, bottom line, go with your heart as it seems to me that you are thinking and seeing things with clarity. This is a journey that affects all of us, we are not alone. We who are travelling the path are not only responsible for our own opening but for the opening of all around us because ultimately we are all the same, it is not a ‘me versus them’ thing at all.
Hope it helps a little and all the best my friend!
Wow thanks EMC,
I didn’t know oxytocin was released by meditation.
Yes, sexual abuse victims can be extremely sensitive. I had a close friend who was abused by her ex, and she seemed perfectly open about discussing sexual subjects. Then one day I asked to wear a shirt that was revealing, and she had worn it three other times with me. She blew up, cut off our friendship, and I haven’t seen her since!
So Carson, keep in mind that your woman may be upset that we are talking about this subject.
Yes she fears change in any aspect, not just sexually. She does NOT like to look in the mirror persay.
No not for me it isn’t. But my wife and I are not very physically intimate except for during sexual times. This may be exasperating the problem? Like I hinted at before, I am not incredibly sexually attracted to my wife. I love her, but I didn’t marry her fthe sex. I don’t know if the lack of intamacy beyond sex is my doing or hers. Probably a bit of both.
I am going to try this, but I fear that this will be another unwelcome “change” for her. She doesn’t like me giving her “attention” in bed. In fact the more I think about it the more I think she only has sex for my sake. (and when she does cocaine cause that makes her really horny) I will let you know how she reacts to this.
Yes this is her. I am not allowed to touch her clitoris unless I am giving her oral sex. This is why it is very hard to get her to orgasm. SHE won’t touch her clitoris during sex either. And because of this the only position she achieves orgasm in is missionary position.
Thank you so much emc for you incredibly helpful advice and for all these physical suggestions I can try. You are truly a huge help for me, thank you.
Love,
Carson
No I don’t think she masturbates. If she does I do not know about it.
I am not allowed to touch her clitoris unless I am giving her oral sex. And I have to beg to be able to give her oral sex. She can only reach orgasm in missionary position when I am on top and push my pevis hard into her clitoris. I am not allowed to touch her clitoris with my hands in any position and she refuses to touch herself as well.
Sorry, but are you suggesting here that we should both be practicing tantra alone? I doubt I will be able to get her to do anything remotely like this.
Love,
Carson
Yes this is exactly how I see it as well. My allowing her to make me orgasm is a bandaid solution, nothing more.
Thanks YIL for the encouragement. But I really don’t know what to do in this situation. My heart says…“?”. But I have been getting lots of useful advice so far that I will try to put into practice. Thanks again for the wonderful reply.
Love,
Carson
Yes, if she knew this topic were on here and her sexual preferences were up for discussion I’m pretty sure I’d be on the couch for months! Good thing she doesn’t give a sh#@ about yoga or AYP! Haha. Maybe not.
Love,
Carson
P.S. I will check out the website tomorrow at work. It won’t work on this computer same as youtube won’t. GOT to get a new computer, haha.
Hey Carson,
I suggest you get info about sexual puja info (i.e. Dinu Roman). It seems fom what you describe her root chakra or sexual chakra are more open than other chakras. Tell me how do you put her legs in the missionary position: on your shoulders (root chakra) or feet touching bed (sexual chakra) ?
About her not allowing you touch her clitoris, I had same problem with my wife but I resolved by her using a vibrator wand (she did it in front of me), later she accepted I have my penis in her vagina & she was using vibrator wand on her clit. Much later, I made slight-shamanic-BSDM ritual by having her drink alcohol so I could touch her clit then she orgasmed with intense kriyas detox. This took care of her accepting to self-touch her clit while my penis in her vagina so you can go after other chakra clearing for re-balance. I suggest to start with dog rear entry position for heart chakra. Then much later (it will take time but you love her), you might go after more shamanic-BDSM where she will be tied up, blind folded,… for deeper clearing.
Nope, I meant only you but it is internal practice (tantra) as opposed as external (shamanic). This method relies on you empath her issue in you so your shadow is reflected by her issue then you mix your conscious issue with her conscious issue. It is self-tantra either white (non-sexual) or red (sexual).
In Shakti, Albert
Good thing she doesn’t give a sh#@ about yoga or AYP! Haha. Maybe not.
but it is internal practice (tantra) as opposed as external (shamanic). This method relies on you empath her issue in you so your shadow is reflected by her issue then you mix your conscious issue with her conscious issue. It is self-tantra either white (non-sexual) or red (sexual).