Biblical Translations.

[Suryakant]

[quote=“CarsonZi”]
I fear I may have to give them an ultimatum, but I am also afraid that that may push them over the edge to the point of literally pounding down my door and dragging me kicking and screaming to a church or minister they deem appropriate.
[/quote]Hi Carson,
Years ago, some of my in-laws who happen to be of the biblical literalist persuasion were doing similar things to their non-converted family members, and I caught some of the side-stream of that. As time went on, they mellowed out, and eventually gave up trying to convert their relatives. Things are much more pleasant now. They’re really sweet people, and I’m glad we can all be together and just relax and laugh and genuinely enjoy each other’s company.
But if that doesn’t happen in your case … well … I say give them the ultimatum. If they trespass on your private property and try to break into your home, call the police - I’m totally serious about that - let them experience being arrested, handcuffed, fingerprinted, and released on their own recognizance. Seriously, Carson, I’m not joking about that. Give 'em tough love. And if they decide they enjoy being repeatedly arrested for trespassing and disturbing the peace, get thee to a judge and take out restraining orders against them, which will put them in prison if they do not leave you alone. Tough love. Give 'em tough love. And if they get themselves imprisoned, let them serve their time. Tough love.

[CarsonZi]

Hi Suryakant,
Thank you for your words of wisdom. My family is filled with wonderful, kindhearted individuals, we just don’t see eye to eye on spiritual matters. I hope my situation turns out like yours did, as I have experienced that peace in that past and want more than anything for this to turn into that again. Only time will tell what will transpire. I really hope I don’t have to go so far as to have them arrested, and I hope they don’t go so far as to come pounding down my door. I doubt I would have them arrested unless they were literally trying to drag me to an exorcist or something. My immediate family lives in another city so I hope they stay there and can let this be. At this point they are only harrassing me with emails and phone calls and I’m staying away from all but the biggest of family gatherings for now. I think my biggest problem is that I have 2 young nephews that I adore, and who adore me, and it is hard to stay away from them for long as they grow up so fast. Oh well, life is never perfect. Thanks again for the advice.
Love,
Carson

[Shanti (Mahasweta)]

Hi Carson,
Don’t dismiss NVC completely.
It is a very powerful tool. Even if it seems impossible to apply it now… just keep it in mind.
In this post Kirtanman posted a paragraph from the book. You can read the entire post, its long but well written. I will however just post the part that he quotes from the book.

@Kirtanman

To hopefully help a little, here’s an “NVC in Action” excerpt from the book, as well as the main NVC website, at www.cnvc.org
The author of the following excerpt is Marshall Rosenberg, PhD (founder of NVC).
Enjoy!
Kirtanman
**
I was presenting Nonviolent Communication in a mosque at Deheisha Refugee Camp in Bethlehem to about 170 Palestinian Moslem men. Attitudes toward Americans at that time were not favorable. As I was speaking, I suddenly noticed a wave of muffled commotion fluttering through the audience. “They’re whispering that you are American!” my translator alerted me, just as a gentleman in the audience leapt to his feet. Facing me squarely, he hollered at the top of his lungs, “Murderer!” Immediately a dozen other voices joined him in chorus:“Assassin!” “Child-killer!” “Murderer!”
Fortunately, I was able to focus my attention on what the man was feeling and needing. In this case, I had some cues. On the way into the refugee camp, I had seen several empty tear gas canisters that had been shot into the camp the night before. Clearly marked on each canister were the words “Made in U.S.A.” I knew that the refugees harbored a lot of anger toward the U.S. for supplying tear gas and other weapons to Israel.
I addressed the man who had called me a murderer:
I: Are you angry because you would like my government to use its resources differently? (I didn’t know whether my guess was correct, but what is critical is my sincere effort to connect with his feeling and need.)
He: Damn right I’m angry! You think we need tear gas? We need sewers, not your tear gas! We need housing! We need to have our own country!
I: So you’re furious and would appreciate some support in improving your living conditions and gaining political independence?
He: Do you know what it’s like to live here for twenty-seven years the way I have with my family—children and all? Have you got the faintest idea what that’s been like for us?
I: Sounds like you’re feeling very desperate and you’re wondering whether I or anybody else can really understand what it’s like to be living under these conditions.
He: You want to understand? Tell me, do you have children? Do they go to school? Do they have playgrounds? My son is sick! He plays in open sewage! His classroom has no books! Have you seen a school that has no books?
I: I hear how painful it is for you to raise your children here; you’d like me to know that what you want is what all parents want for their children—a good education, opportunity to play and grow in a healthy environment . . .
He: That’s right, the basics! Human rights—isn’t that what you Americans call it? Why don’t more of you come here and see what kind of human rights you’re bringing here!
I: You’d like more Americans to be aware of the enormity of the suffering here and to look more deeply at the consequences of our political actions?
Our dialogue continued, with him expressing his pain for nearly twenty more minutes, and I listening for the feeling and need behind each statement.
I didn’t agree or disagree. I received his words, not as attacks, but as gifts from a fellow human willing to share his soul and deep vulnerabilities with me.

NOTE: Italics above mine. - Kirtanman
Once the gentleman felt understood, he was able to hear me as I explained my purpose for being at the camp. An hour later, the same man who had called me a murderer was inviting me to his home for a Ramadan dinner.

Here is the rest of the post.

@Kirtanman

Hi EMC & All,
I am currently re-reading Non-Violent Communication: A Language of Life, by Marhsall Rosenberg, PhD.
It is one of the most powerful sets of teachings, as relates to consciousness, that I have ever had the pleasure of being exposed to, and that I am humbly doing my best to adopt.

One of the main reasons I experience NVC as SO powerful, is that our verbal communication tends to be such a blind spot for most of us, based on our cultural and social conditioning.
Even very “spiritual” or “yogic” people can be far more violent in their verbal communication than they realize.
And, candidly, when I was first exposed to NVC, I let my ego get in the way – and I didn’t think all that much of it (NVC, that is - apparently I thought a lot of my ego, at the time … )
However, a couple of years back, when I was facing a tough communication situation within my family, I got some NVC “counseling” from a good friend of mine, who is an NVC facilitator, and the results were amazing.
In a nutshell: if you truly desire to connect with others in true communication, NVC provides a framework which helps this to be possible.
Often, for most of us, even that sincere desire to communicate can be clouded over by egoic agenda, semi-conscious attempts to control, blame, manipulate - or to defend, react, feel guilty, etc. as a reaction to the communication of others.
As A Course in Miracles so succinctly and eloquently states: there are only two ways of being in the world: Love, and Calling Out for Love (violence, anger, aggression, blame, defensiveness, guilt, etc. are all near-unconscious ways of calling out for love).
When we understand this, Love becomes our natural, authentic and ultimately empowered response to all situations.

And I’m not talking “hearts and flowers”, second-chakra, emotion-based pseudo-love … I’m talking LOVE … the essential power of reality … Satyagraha.
(If that term sounds familiar to anyone, it attained a certain degree of Sanskritical acclaim in the middle of the last century, as the name of Mahatma Gandhi’s spiritual-political movement.
Gandhi described Satyagraha - “The Power of Reality”, as one side of the coin.
The other side of the coin?
Ahimsa … Non-Violence.
Incidentally, the Foreward to Non-Violent Communication: A Language of Life, was written by Arun Gandhi … Mahatma Gandhi’s grandson.
NVC is more than a helpful set of communication techniques … it is essentially a yoga unto itself - “verbal yoga”.

(I define a Yoga as any path or discipline which can take a person or group into direct realization / experience of the essential Oneness of reality.)
Can NVC really be that powerful?
I would say “yes” - but as with all things yoga - it is up to each of us to make this determination for ourselves.

[newpov (new point of view)]

Carson,
As pressures build up over the years, things often detonate at big family gatherings, especially on religious holidays like Thanksgiving.
Thanksgiving is right around the corner. Enforced herd solidarity will be the rule of the day. There will be pious prayers, and all disagreements will be suppresed, though they simmer beneath the surface of conversation. You know what I am saying and what happens. Feeling as you do, do you want to be complicit to another repeat of past Thanksgivings?
What do you want to be thankful for THIS year?
You can try verbal ju-jitsu, including non-violent “echoing” techniques, but I don’t believe cleverness of this sort will defuse a concerted mob of smugly fundamentalist idealogues.
Given all this, what is your plan?
You need to line one up now, in my opinion. What is it? If you have no plan of approach to this holiday gathering, you are drifting and gambling. Is this failure to take responsibility for improving your welfare?
Please consider taking a stand before Thanksgiving, and communicating it at your initiative, not in reaction to their ongoing or entirely predictable future emotional assaults. Be proactive.
Lay out an agenda, advance your agenda. Express your needs and desires, and convey what you expect of them.
“The hand that writes the memo rules the committee.” If they have no plan, certainly not in time for Thanksgiving, then I believe you will prevail with yours.
Let this holiday, which would otherwise be yet another day of denial and another year lost, have possibility of turning into a meeting which accomplishes some useful family business – for a change.
An Adult Male would take this approach. Take charge and shape events this year. Don’t act as someone junior to any others in the family. They are no longer your betters. Why, then, take a timid approach?
Your wife will be there to back you up, but she can’t do this if the two of you haven’t decided upon a plan of action culminating in that day.
Getting that letter out now, allowing them plenty of time to consider it before that day, increases odds for an outcome favorable to you.
Timing is everything.
newpov

[CarsonZi]

Hi Shanti,
I’m sorry, I didn’t mean to dismiss NVC…That wasn’t my intention. I totally understand how valuable it can be. Please forgive my improper expression. And sorry this is so short, I’ve had an incredibly busy day and time is very minimal. Will hopefully get time to respond in depth later.
Hi Brian,
Lucky for me I live in Canada and Thanksgiving has already happened. Next big gathering is Christmas so I have 2 months to prepare. I am working on my plan of action but have been very busy today (got a new job while working the old one) and I will try to respond soon as to what my exact approach will be. UNtil then…
Thank you all for your helpful advice. Namaste.
Love,
Carson

[CarsonZi]

Shanti,
Sorry my above post was so short. Like I said, I am fairly aware of the power of NVC although I have never read a book on the subject. Having dialectic conversation as a bit of a forte of mine, I find I am easily able to discern the underlying message in most people’s statements. What I am not great at yet, is not ever getting defensive or aggressive. I’m getting much better but sometimes if the topic is something I am still deeply passionate about, the conversation may end up getting emotional. What is the title of the NVC book you were referencing and who is the author. I should pick it up for sure. I gather the title is A Course in Miracles? Would appreciate any info you can provide.
Love,
Carson

[Shanti (Mahasweta)]

The NVC book is called
“Nonviolent Communication: A Language of Compassion” by Marshall B. Rosenberg, Ph.D.
This is their website: http://www.cnvc.org/ (you can read the first chapter in that link above).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nonviolent_Communication
Nonviolent Communication (NVC) is a process developed by Marshall Rosenberg and others which people use to communicate with greater compassion and clarity. It focuses on two things: honest self-expression — exposing what matters to oneself in a way that’s likely to inspire compassion in others, and empathy — listening with deep compassion. Formal NVC self-expression includes four elements: observations (distinguished from interpretations/evaluations), feelings (emotions separate from thoughts), needs (deep motives) and requests (clear, present, doable and without demand).
Those who use nonviolent communication (also called “compassionate communication”) describe all actions as motivated by an attempt to meet human needs. However, in meeting those needs, they seek to avoid the use of coercion (e.g., inducing fear, guilt, shame, praise, blame, duty, obligation, punishment, or reward). The goal of NVC is to get one’s own needs met while also meeting others’ needs. A key principle of nonviolent communication that supports this is the capacity to express oneself without use of good/bad, right/wrong judgment, hence the emphasis on expressing feelings and needs, instead of criticisms or judgments.

A COURSE IN MIRACLES is a very powerful spiritual tool…

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Course_In_Miracles
A Course in Miracles (also referred to as ACIM or the Course) written by Dr. Helen Schucman and Dr. William Thetford that describes a new approach to spirituality based on Christian teachings.
ACIM integrates ideas from Christianity, Eastern religions, mysticism, psychology, and Platonism, viewing reality as monistically consisting of a single thing, the love of God and the physical world as a projection in the mind. ACIM focuses on cultivating awareness of love in the self and in others. Believers in ACIM consider it an inspired scripture using Biblical terminology, but possessing a greater coherence by dint of its consistent source.

I find this statement very powerful:
The opening statement of the Course, “Nothing real can be threatened. Nothing unreal exists. Herein lies the peace of God.”

[CarsonZi]

Thanks Shanti.
I will be picking up both books in the near future as it seems as if my current situation could really benefit from this knowledge. I think I could benefit from NVC at my new job as well as the homeless and working poor can tend to get a little overzealous with their communication and NVC seems as if it would be a perfect fit for that situation as well. Thanks again.
Love,
Carson