And also I just wanted to add one more thing which my dear Sir Terence McKenna touched upon.
That there seems to be some sort of ‘synergy’ (that may not be the right word, maybe ‘compatibility’?) between the psychedelics and sexual energy. And all,if not, most of advanced Yoga deals with sexual energy.
This,as I mentioned previously, I noticed when I was on a high dose of mushroom and tried the Kechari mudra(stage 1). When I entered the mudra, bliss started emanating from my pelvis.
Most definitely my sober experiences of kechari have been far more enjoyable, but the question arises, why did it work?
It works, both on or off a substance, because your body is matured, quiet, open. I personally have an ongoing discussion with myself about cannabis, and my long time use. I am not willing to give it up (when on it, Bhakti is off leash) but I have made changes, and continue to inquire about it, and always test myself, how true is that thought?
Much different than DMT for sure, but this thread is a blessing.
You’re right! Kechari does work on and off substance, and also,you, albeit for a different matter mentioned Bhakti. That’s what I believe was diluted when kechari worked on shrooms though it wasn’t at the time working when sober…I suppose Bhakti which is a flavour of love is a major theme on shrooms which may have provided a fertile ground for the execution of such mudras (not to mention the other energetic aspects at play)…
My relationship with cannabis is a strange one… anecdotally cannabis I believe is a supreme purifier… post my opening of nervous system, my cannabis consumption has been fairly less compared to the kgs I have consumed a long time back prior to it…
These are the things I noticed on cannabis post my nervous system opening:
- It pretty much kills any sensation of prana/pranic vibrations. I think it’s suggested as a good anti-kundalini medicine for this reason. This especially I noticed on my visit to high vibration places such as temples. On normal visits I used to feel blissful ecstatic vibrations, but on cannabis, none of those - even though as you rightly put, I felt more Bhakti emanating from me.
- it reinforces the ego. Sober when I used to read texts like Bhagavad Gita I used to be like “Wow. So he is a God. How amazing! How lucky are we to receive such divine knowledge!” Whereas on cannabis, I could hardly give a damn - this shocked me - I had to make effort to care and empathize.
- it extremely purifying. I have noticed this prior and post nervous system open too. In fact it was partly because of cannabis purifying (along with the mad abuse of spinal breathing and blocking method
) that I was first able to consume the Soma drip for the first time. - needless to say - it’s very grounding. So grounding in fact that I used to go on and on with spinal breathing non-stop on it when I could barely go for a few mins when sober.
I only dabbed with cannabis for a couple months post my nervous system opening. After this episode was over, months later I found a small amount and consumed it and it felt so free,stress-free, grounded, happy and blissful I literally thought as I sent a sigh of relief - “Finally the Gods have answered my prayers!!!
" - though I have felt the combination of all those feelings otherwise too, I think the extra added dopamine hit from the concentrated hash was the real push towards that ecstasy.
Weed too, same as DMT, is a mysterious substance. The first time I took a cannabis post the opening of nervous system I could feel two orbs of heat inside me as though they were rotating. One was at my chest, the other at my navel. And once I actually felt the ‘spinal nerve’ as a thin thread of energy. It started at my lower back and ended behind my head, it was a VERY obvious sensation - like I really had thought Sir Yogani was speaking metaphorically about it. Lol I remember even searching the forum then to see if this had happened to anyone else
In a TV show called the Magicians a person says - 'Life is raw. Most medicate”. I think yoga rightfully combined with tantra thanks to Sir Yogani is the all-natural medication, like Madam Jana Dixon says - ‘Kundalini is God’s intoxicant.’
^This is why DMT is another mystery and a worthy candidate for investigation - it has ZERO effects on your mind whatsoever. Though there is a euphoric afterglow - on the substance you are 100% lucid. there is insane intoxication on mushrooms,lsd, cannabis and so on, but nada on DMT. Though the energetic effects of DMT may tweak your thought process or your mental energy temporarily, your mind is crystal clear on the substance. I repeat again - it has zero effect on your mind whatsoever.
Moderator note: Topic moved for better placement
DMT users mention something called as a ‘Carrier Wave’.
The Carrier Wave is the eeeee tinnitus sound which one experiences upon consumption of a breakthrough dose of the molecule , and it is believed that this is what helps to reach the other realms.
This eee sound is nothing but the Anahata.
Hatha Yoga Pradipika states meditation on the Anahata is the highest form of meditation.
And my experience when meditation upon the same is that it completely purifies the nadi system like nothing else. It’s supposedly the highest vibration, meditation upon which, your body too adapts to that state of vibration - I can confirm the same.
Not fully on topic, but I find it interesting that yogic_senary mentioned that cannabis pretty much kills any pranic sensations. For me it is the opposite. Even on a tiny dose (a tiny 5mg piece of dried bud from a vaporiser) ecstatic sensations become very strong and it requires some will power to not get carried away into some orgasmic reverie but to follow through with a meditation session.
With such a cannabis microdose meditation becomes very fascinating for me. The mantra and pranic flows apart from being perceived in more detail have the additional quality of becoming visually three-dimensional delicate and delicately moving objects, as if they are actual physical objects. Outside of meditation a lot of the other sensory input is also synesthetically represented three-dimensionally and visually when I close my eyes. For instance, if I concentrate on my hands (with eyes closed) I can clearly see them on a dark background giving off some blue-ish light. When I move my hands and fingers the visual image responds instantaneously as if I was actually seeing it. So it’s not a conscious but an involuntary visualisation. I can even see my finger nails giving off a slightly different shade of blue. It’s very weird. The effect is the same even if the hand is behind my back, so I obviously don’t actually see it with my eyes. I think the ability to locate body parts (which is related to the sense of touch I guess) and maybe that nails and skin feel differently through inner perception became somehow represented visually, a form of synesthesia.
A friend who has also developed some ecstatic conductivity through AYP and also enjoys psychedelics, did not get any enhancement from this tiny dose of cannabis, but simply felt “stoned”, which did the opposite of enhancing the meditation experience. It seems that everyone reacts differently to these substances. It could also be that I react unusually to cannabis because I only tried it the first time in my life after having developed some ecstatic conductivity.
Not only does everyone react differently to these substances, the same person may react differently to the same substance at different times.
Well, your experiences have do have validity in the sense of weed being a mild psychedelic, stimulant and an aphrodisiac.
Also to add in the fact that, supposedly it’s not so much the pineal gland, but it’s the lungs which contain DMT, which is why many(including me) report a similarity in experience after Bhastrika Pranayama.
Sir Terence McKenna said “If DMT isn’t what the world religions are guarding, then they are guarding an empty house”.
Sir Yogani is in the same stance as the ancient Yogic scriptures which do not recommend consumption of herbs and drugs on the path of Yoga (a.k.a path of perfectionism).
I’m honestly leaning towards a synergy of the two, even though in my heart I know Sir Yogani and the ancient scriptures are right.
DMT (and mushrooms) are stimulants. There is definitely a shaktipat phenomenon going on, but the Shakti seems to be coming from an entity which sometimes seems so bizzare and alien.
Kundalini is also a stimulant and a Goddess entity. Combined with celibacy and the raw power of sexual energy, it can trump any drug in the world. But the Shakti seems to be coming from a very familiar, grounded and organic entity in this case.
Is it possible combining the power of Kundalini, pranayama and Anahata meditation to breakthrough to other realms? I have heard reports of people who practice Kundalini Yoga achieve the same. But a childish question pops up - Do we want to? How do we ‘turn it off’? Seeing as to how I have never broken through to hyperspace through Yogic methods, I can’t comment much on it, but maybe the methods to come back to our material existence will manifest on our paths towards the breakthrough phenomenon. I mean isn’t that the promise? Yoga promises bodily immortality, even though I may achieve that, I’m still a part of this material existence even though I may be feeling light and breezy.
But what if I could enjoy all the ecstasy achieved through Yogic mudras, breakthrough to other higher realms, and then come back - this I think is the end game. This is the promise. This is liberation. This is freedom.
I am of the bloodline of the ancient sages and there is not a single instance in my known and unknown ancestral history where they have used drugs, and without which they seem to have come so far towards the truth. And we all know Soma is not a psychedelic. And yet I hold great reverence towards these South American Shamanism herbs, because they are part of the greater truth and the biggest picture and must simply not be brushed aside, without atleast giving them the benefit of the doubt.
Well I fantasize that all Yogis have an unquestionable stand in the domain of spirituality enough to meet these psychedelic substances and entities with an equal standing by shaking their hands rather than submitting yourself(nothing wrong with submitting yourself to them, after all these are great entities who deserve reverence). So more power to you, my friends!!
In my heart I know Yoga is the endgame 
, but the mystery of psychedelics is equal in magnitude to the mystery of Kundalini.
Well it’s been quite some time since I made this post and wanted to share some events that took place regarding this.
Obviously it’s not my place to give recommendations for your spiritual journey, but I would advise to avoid Ayahuasca if you’re a serious Yoga Practitioner.
Sometime back I consumed a tiny dose of it. And because of my sensitivity, the effects were profound. Though the trip had certain beauty to it, it resulted in disassociation and panic attacks for months following it. It was very challenging to ground myself because the medicine had blasted with me energy. The disassociation and panic attacks lasted 3 months until a family friend came for a casual visit to my house. Apparently he had achieved some siddhi(don’t know the details). He took my hand and did some shaktipat thing and said ‘There! I fixed you’ . And it actually worked immediately. The fear and attacks stopped from then. Although I didn’t tell him about the drug, he figured something was the issue. He said my ‘chandra nadi’ was out of balance. I have no idea what he meant but was just relieved it was over and that I had finally come down.
Like I have mentioned previously in this thread,DMT and Aya are much different drugs.
I also tried low doses of DMT and found no lasting effects, though I would still advise caution when planning for a huge dose if you’re practicing a lot of advanced yoga. Interestingly my kundalini was supercharged when I consumed low doses of DMT and in once instance the sexual energy shot up with tremendous force from my base towards my chest.
There is something to these substances such as mushroom and DMT which act on sexual energy and sometimes even have erotic undertones to the trips.
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Hi yogic_scenery,
You are not the first yogi to have issues with Ayahuasca or DMT. Several cases have come up over the years with outcomes similar to what you describe. Hallucinogens in general can provide some experiences that may inspire one to seriously engage in spiritual practices (see Lesson 307). But once one has been engaged in practices for some time, with the subtle neurobiology significantly purified, then hallucinogens have a diminishing return, or worse, an outright destabilization in the yoga practitioner as you have indicated, in some cases more extreme. Hallucinogens are not spiritual practice, though some may disagree. At best, they may be a preview of possibilities for a permanent enlightenment when time-tested practices are undertaken over the long term.
The discussion copied below from an AYP Plus lesson addition to 307, is along the lines you are bringing up here.
A word to wise advanced practitioners is usually sufficient. 
The guru is in you.
Addition 307.1 - Dialog on Ayahuasca, Yoga, Dissociation and Fear (Audio)
Jan 21, 2016Q1: I am having a bit of a situation… very unstable, waves of panic… hard time grasping on to what is “real.”
A few months back, I participated in an Ayahuasca ceremony. The experience was fairly traumatic for me… purging for most of the ceremony, waves of panic off and on for hours, and a difficult time distinguishing a sense of time or even “me.”
Within a couple of days everything settled back to “normal” but with a sense that much had been released, and a noticeable lack of anxiety or panic in daily life… a welcome change.
More recently, I had been doing targeted bastrika on a couple of stubborn blocks, and after a few weeks, added cosmic samyama. Then one night, while sitting in bed watching TV, the waves of panic started, and a feeling of being back in the Ayahuasca ceremony… just not to the same level of intensity. But a similar series of panic and “dissociation” followed by some periods of feeling OK and settled.
This has been going on for about two days. I’ve stopped all practices and am trying to breathe through the periods of panic, but it is hard. I feel like I’m losing my mind. Any advice, suggestions, and any help you can provide to get back to a place of stability would be appreciated.
A1: It is hard to say how a powerful hallucinogenic experience with ayahuasca (DMT) might affect already refined states of consciousness from years of spiritual practice. Obviously not favorably in your case. Can’t say I recommend such risky experiments.
Probably best to treat it as we would any overload or kundalini experience getting ahead of us – back off, self-pace, apply the known methods for stabilization, and keep busy in the world.
Regarding “dissociation,” such episodes are nearly always temporary, so have faith. Permanent dissociation is extremely rare, because it is not in human nature to be permanently dissociated. We adjust, integrate the suddenly expanded state of consciousness and carry on, and so will you. So not to worry. Easily be with it and know that the discomfort will pass…
Do keep me posted – writing can help a lot during periods of adjustment, whether it is private journaling or to another.
Q2: Thank you so much for responding. I agree on it being a risky experiment; should have known better… and I should have known better than to push practices a few months after. In writing out the sequence that I followed, that is pretty obvious.
The words of reassurance on the dissociation were very helpful; having not gone through it before it can be pretty unsettling. Diving into daily activity… work, exercise and family are helping.
I am feeling better today for the first time in a few days, less instability and less panic. Thank you for your support and guidance.
A2: Glad to hear things are settling down. It is going to be alright.
Q3: Thank you… got your email right as a wave of panic crept back up… settled things right down. Your timing is impeccable. Have you had periods like this in your experiences over the years?
A3: Yes, I had plenty of challenges decades ago in the early and mid years, when practices were far less organized and measured than we have in AYP now. My experiences of excess were more along the lines of John Wilder’s – physical more than mental. Later on, there were some periods of dissociation, but by then there was enough inner silence to weather the confusion occurring in the mind. As sense of self becomes more centered in inner silence, periods of dissociation (or any unfamiliar experience) are more easily taken in stride because the witness is not affected.
Instead of fear, I found there to be a sense of acceptance of the inevitability of what was happening. It is a normal stage in the progression toward unity, and we do survive it. I can see how difficult it could be becoming suddenly and prematurely dissociated from using a powerful hallucinogen. Nevertheless, you will adapt. In the long run, your practices with good integration in daily activity will bring you home. Short cuts can come at a high cost.
The mental stuff is a passing show, and sooner or later stabilization happens. It will happen for you also. The drug experience you had threw a monkey wrench into the process, but it is something you will recover from. Just a bump in the road.
Q4: Thank you! Yes, just a bump in the road… I will make that my mantra. I have stopped all practices since a few days ago. Is that what you would recommend until ongoing stability is achieved?
A4: You should go with the amount of self-pacing that supports a return to stabilization in daily activity. If it means no practice for a while, then that is what it is. When you are feeling more stable, you can inch back with a little deep meditation (like 10 minutes) and see how it goes, adding back bit by bit over weeks and months, with stability and increasing harmony in daily living being the primary criteria each step along the way.
All the best!
The guru is in you.
That conversation is absolutely on point and articulated very well as to how my experience was too.
Though I knew better and had never plans on consuming it, what I was consuming was touted to be a micro-dose. My sensitivity combined with the reverse tolerance of the substance led to a semi-full blown trip.
One post effect I noticed was the sensations of heat which was a fairly occasional/rare occurance became much more frequent. What used to be a comforting heat sensation suddenly became invasive of sorts.
To top it off, even a single night where I didn’t sleep resulted in mania and paranoia.
What I found relatively helpful at the time was greenary, water bodies like beaches, Nadi Shodhana pranayama.
And by no means is this a bad rep to that sacred substance, had I been in a presence of a wise shaman maybe(emphasis on maybe) the side effects would have been diluted.
But nevertheless from the perspective of Yoga this is what the scriptures have to say - ‘Drugs,herbs and substances provide temporary siddhis and is not recommended. Yogic practices which is practiced like a monkey eating it’s food i.e little by little results in long lasting powers and is approved by Shiva’
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