Very beautiful, thank you for sharing Jeff
Nice post Jeff, but I can’t put myself into one specific level. I’d say I’m in level 3 but there are many things from other levels going on here. For example, I can notice obstructions (level 4) and I do something to clean it and I can see a whitish substance around objects and people’s head/body but I can’t see chakras and absolutely NO astral experience here whatsoever. I can also see myself getting angry and stop it (level 6) but there are still impurities to be released. I’m also beginning to develop a thoughtless state (level 7) where meditation and life are the same and I can notice All is one especially when I’m into this thoughtless state as this is the way things are when looked at without the lenses of mind.
Rod
Hi Rod,
Thanks for sharing. Yes, “levels” were really more meant as a general framework. All spiritual development is multidimensional, so some will skip (or not notice) some aspects. Also, as you have said, there will be overlap.
From your description, it sounds like good things are happening. 
Best,
Jeff
What “stage” would you say you are in?
Thanks.
Any such "self judgement" is the ego's playground. I just know that there is no such thing as done. Enjoy the moment (and the day)! :slight_smile:
Hi Kami,
As I stated in the OP, at the time I wrote it, it was a combination of my own experience and a few that I respect/trust. And, as I am sure you know (and many of the AYP members can attest), I am not really into books, pop culture teachers and theoretical stuff. I must prefer the “direct” approach… diving deep, not intellectualism…
Best regards,
Jeff
Hi Kami,
Happy to answer and share.
The concept and meaning of the “rainbow body” is easier to understand with some broader framework of ongoing spiritual development. For those who are interested, I have attempted to give some of that overview in the Riju & Jeff thread related to the later/completion stages (emptiness of ultimate reality).
After one has realized the emptiness of self, they have collapsed the local chakra system and it becomes sort of an “unified field”. That unified field is the beginning of what is called the “light body” or in some traditions the “body of truth”. As one continues to drop obstructions, the light body increasing integrates into “perceived reality” or from the individual perspective, the light body is seen to grow and stabilize. The term “rainbow” relates to increasing depth (or refinement) of the light. Similar to how light looks white/clear, but when hitting a prism, we see at a deeper level it is actually a full spectrum of color.
Each human body has sort a “limit” of how much integration/light it can hold before breaking down(destabilizing) into its light component particles. Depending on the tradition, one either wants to “leave/ascend” as soon as possible (classic immortal path) or wants to “stay” as long as the physical body is capable of supporting the light flows. Staying as long as possible is usually preferred by those who follow a Buddha or Christ path, as with such a divine being, the light flows though into the physical plane, helping to clarify/process karma for beings.
On teachers… Let’s just say, I think many are more in the “business” of spiritual advancement then truly knowledgable themselves. In my experience, if one “knows” they can explain/show in simple terms.
Regarding, my personal practices… Currently, I mostly just “reside” and notice the flow. The last few years I have also done a fair amount of exploring universal mind.
Regarding recommendations… I don’t think there is a “one size fits all” particularly when you get to the deeper levels. All spiritual growth is infinitely dimensional. But, on an individual level, I am always happy to share my perspective.
Finally, my comments here and in the Riju thread are my personal sharings and not from any book (or sutra). Others mileage may vary, but whenever possible I have included friends (some AYP members) for independent verification.
Best wishes,
Jeff
It makes sense to view the different stages as possibilities that are available for investigation and independent verification if so inclined.
On the relation of personal experiences… I find a general framework to be more useful than an account of any particular experience, especially since there is a tendency to grasp for the experiences we want to have. One person’s experiences may be entirely different from my own, and if I am looking for something specific that I have read about, I may miss what is already right there in front of my eyes. A conceptual framework allows me to map my own experience to a form of “milestone” - hopefully without getting attached to any kind of notion of “attainment.”
On the rainbow body… I have also read Norbu’s “Dzogchen: The Self Perfected State” and, if I recall correctly, the body of light is “built” during a person’s lifetime but only becomes manifest upon a person’s death. I’m willing to wait a very long time for a demonstration.
On the question of who does the exploring… Is it possible to be rid of all vestiges of ego while still in a body/mind? And if one finds that no one is exploring, then what is the issue with the experience of exploration?
Love 
Hi Kami,
Regarding your “direct experience” comment… I believe that question has been asked and answered in my earlier posts. They are my experience. Also, glad to hear that you have found someone who has described something similar.
Regarding your “realized” and comparison point… As I stated in the OP, the stages were formulated in attempt to be generic as to tradition, that is why I include descriptions of mind states, energy body states and examples of each stage. I wanted it to be as flexible (and hence more useful) to people. Also, the stages were designed as a potential guideline for oneself, not to compare. Why would anyone want to judge and compare to others (as with your Yogani) example)?
On your no “one” point… Many traditions agree with your implied perspective, but your description of Buddhism is not accurate. In Buddhism, all existence/perception is “conditioned” and hence some degree of “separation” (including a Buddha). Similar to the words of Jesus, a Son of God is “one with God”, but does not “cease” and can go on to “do greater things” than he did.
Best,
Jeff
Hi Whippoorwill,
Thanks for your questions, though I am not quite sure if they were for me or Kami.
If me, my personal experience has been that we have the “ability to act”. It is not all just a fixed movie. Additionally, as you have stated, as long as there is existence, there is some level of conditioning and as I said above… Some degree of separation. But once one has realized the emptiness of self, they know there is nothing to fear and no real boundaries that cannot be dropped.
Best regards,
Jeff
Hi Kami,
I do not see the point of your copying a long blog post of a sutra into this thread?
I have repeatedly discussed the “emptiness of self” and how it relates to the perceived “local” being. Additionally, I have recommend the Lankavatra sutra which discusses the components in detail in recent threads.
It seems that we simply just disagree on the “cessation” point. You may have found some point where there is no longer some form of “separate” view, but my experience has been the same as Yogani describes in the AYP lessons. Distinct perception continues.
Best wishes,
Jeff
Hi Jeff,
When you talk about physical body “limits” do you mean subject A’s body can integrate higher frequencies while subject B’s body can’t even though both are healthy? Perhaps these are new terms/words for me and I misunderstood. I thought anyone reasonably healthy could potentially “evolve” up to the same point.
I believe that if we want to know the truth–and by the truth, I mean abiding in the perfection of Now–then we must trace the threads of our thoughts and feelings to the seed desires from which they spring, and once these seeds are found, we can relax in trusting that they will sprout–in due time, and by divine decree.
Not all desires and dreams are meant to come to be, and I’ll quote the great lyricist John Prine:
“If dreams were thunder, and lightning was desire, this old house would’ve burned down a long time ago.”
Here we are, and we will be here until we are not, and when we are not, we will probably be somewhere else, which is still part of here, so actually, there is nowhere to go even though we are going everywhere. A few sidesteps notwithstanding.
Are we clear? 
Hi digofarias,
My deeper point is that we are not our bodies, or said another way… We are not limited to our physical bodies. Just as some people can run faster or jump higher, different physical bodies have various capacities to hold light/energy. As an example, in general, women can hold more energy/light than men. Also, the human form has been evolving in general lately, which can be seen manifest at a physical level in the rapidly growing technology over the last few hundred years.
Ultimately we all have the same potential, but some of that work is done “beyond” the physical human body.
Best regards,
Jeff
This is an interesting look at the various “attainments” one’s persona seems to experience. But real spirituality has nothing to do with attainment. It’s the very opposite of that. It’s about finding yourself identifying less and less with the individuality of a persona. To gather spiritual merit badges for a persona is to work the other way.
Awakening from a dream is not a shift of experience, but of fundamental perspective. In this case, rather than beholding Entirety from a perspective of separateness, you find yourself identifying (much to your surprise!) as the Entirety. And that’s it! This minute flip of perspective is the whole thing. All the other spiritual stuff is mere yadda-yadda.
Here are the stages of this subtle flip of perspective. The sole change herein is of perspective, and nothing else! (though I’ve included a few chatty asides that, while hopefully interesting, are not directly relevant):
- I’m in here and everything else (i.e. the world, as well any deeper intelligence) is out there.
- I’m in here and everything else is out there, but the deeper intelligence weirdly seems to be in here, too!
- There’s no difference between “in here” and “out there”. There’s no separate “me-in-here”, yet that nonexistent me-in-here absurdly takes credit for the realization (“I’m enlightened”!). Some truth has been glimpsed, yet the frame of perspective remains rigidly stuck right where it was. This is the stage of spiritual arrogance. This is where 99% of spiritual writings come from, as we share/spew transpersonal wisdom in order to grow our personal brand.
- Perspective blinks between both identifications, like an optical illusion that makes you flip between two interpretations. Sometimes I identify as Entirety, and sometimes I discover, to my chagrin, that identity has flipped back to me-in-here. Old habits die hard! At this point, it’s quite easy to revert, long-term, to identifying as “me-in-here” without noticing it, all while continuing to feel spiritually advanced. If so, welcome back to #3, likely for a long time (don’t ever cease your sadhana!).
- I’m still bouncing between identifications, but I clearly observe it all from a higher perspective. I watch myself flip back and forth with bemusement and forgiveness - i.e. the way God (or however you’d refer to the broadest possible perspective) might view it. This is no longer an irritating back-and-forth experienced by some separate me-in-here. Instead, it just is what it is, viewed from the perspective of Entirety, which at some point became (without my noticing) my solid basis of identification. Soon, the bouncing settles. This is the start of spiritual maturity.
- I seem (to my surprise upon observing my own actions) to have joined Team Entirety, though externally I still appear to be the usual persona. Entirety has become my default perspective. I can (and do!) intentionally and effortlessly flip back to pretending to be a separate and individual me-in-here, just for kicks and entertainment (which is why I pretended to adopt a dramatic persona in the first place). “I’ll just KILL myself if the Red Sox lose!” But when I do, it’s experienced lightly and playfully.
- As I playfully pretend, with relish and enthusiasm, some particularly dramatic and gripping experience makes me utterly forget myself - like a moviegoer forgetting she’s in a theater. I fall, yet again, into a hypnotic trance, having gotten caught up in the pretending.
- I’m in here and everything else (i.e. the world, as well any deeper intelligence) is out there.
The notion that there’s magnificent awesomeness awaiting you at the “end” of it all is adolescent and silly. For one thing, there’s no endpoint, as it’s a circle.
Again, it’s not about “attainment”. If your magnificence lasts more than four hours, call your doctor.
That’s one thing I love about this forum…you can dig through the archives and resurrect any topic you so desire.
And…you can also relish in, and reflect upon, behind-the-scenes experiences you’ve had with forum writers.
@Jim - Love it! 
Sey
Thank you, Jim.
“Doctor, I have a magnificence problem…”
Me-in-here thoroughly enjoyed this!
become the light don’t just look at it
When did you stop being the light? In fact, is it possible to stop? Have you tried?
There’s no “becoming”. The only thing that can change is perspective.
Maybe “Stop pretending you’re not the light.”