Hi Jim,
When you say this I realize that it’s obvious that nearly 2 years of putting the attention in the head by doing spinal breathing has contributed majorly to the problems I have now with energy in the head. I could feel it gradually increasing over the months, but first I thought it was a nice sign of progress, then I hoped it was normal, then it became too much.
It may take a lot of putting the attention elsewhere, maybe in the feet or heart, to undo this. Yogani has also given a nice practice, cosmic samyama, that puts attention elsewhere.
To answer specifically, Weaver, nowhere in AYP does it say to “place attention in the head” in spinal breathing. Like all of AYP, it’s an extremely simple practice - put attention up and down and up the spine. Period. Anything you add on to the simplicity of AYP is (IMO) needlessly complicating things. Sambhavi does indeed bring attention to head, but mulha bandha balances it, as does the practice itself. I’d suggest you aim to practice without a “point of view”. Do it like brushing your teeth.
But in terms of attention placement generally, I hope Yogani or someone else will correct me if I’m misstating AYP teachings, but, at least while you’re doing practices, don’t place attention anywhere…except if a practice calls for it (e.g. in spinal breathing, per above). Other than that, place attention in the mantra, period. Other than that, don’t direct ANYTHING. Anything else you “do” is an add-on, and it seems puzzling to choose to practice the most stripped down and simple of yoga practices…and then complicate it! 
When not doing practices, it’s freeform. Most yoga schools suggest residing in ajna or heart. But I bet Yogani would say that’s all under the hood; to not worry about it and just live life.
Exception: per my posting above, if you feel crown stuff going on, attention to ajna brings control.
If you do AYP and you systematically place attention somewhere, that’s 1. not a great idea and 2. not recommened by AYP. But then again, AYP also recommends against crown practice till the very end. And Yogani himself has said (a while ago, so this might be old info) that he himself is not yet directly opening crown. So that gives an idea of how far one ought to wait. Though, as in all things, mileage varies…
Hi Jim,
When I said “putting the attention in the head” I should have stated it as “letting the attention move through the head”, meaning the procedure that is stated in AYP Lesson 41 http://www.aypsite.org/41.html and quoted below for general information:
“…with each rising inhalation of the breath, allow your attention to travel upward inside a tiny thread, or tube, you visualize beginning at your perineum, continuing up through the center of your spine, and up through the stem of your brain to the center of your head. At the center of your head the tiny nerve makes a turn forward to the point between your eyebrows. With one slow, deep inhalation let your attention travel gradually inside the nerve from the perineum all the way to the point between the eyebrows. As you exhale, retrace this path from the point between the eyebrows all the way back down to the perineum.”
Sorry for not clarifying that.
Then I’m not understanding your previous posting. The practice you’ve quoted does not involve lingering attention in the head. It describes a balanced flow of attention up and down.
Just for the record, I’ve been having lots of crown and third eye activity. I find my awareness inside of a big stillness when my head is heating or expanding. Sometimes there is that vortex thing going on. The top of my head has “little fingers” moving around in a small circle, kind of loving like, my medulla and ajna have similar activity, and there is a connection and movement all around between these and around them. My throat gets parched. I feel the stillness behind my eyes and stare off into space a lot and my vision seems deeper. All this has been going on more so now for a month whether or not I’ve been consistent with my practice. When I do get more consistent the activity increases in intensity and duration. I was going to post this when Kirtanman began the thread and didn’t for some reason, but it seems like something similar to share. Sometimes I tell myself that I’ve just had too much tea. It feels expansive.
Hi Balance,
Does all this activity in the higher chakras concern you, or are you O.K. with it?
Christi
Hi Christi
Thanks for checking to see if I am okay with this. Yes I’m fine with it all. I just felt like recording the experiences here as they seem to have ramped up lately, and I was curious with the possibility that many of us might be having similar experiences at the same time. Interestingly, since the day I wrote the above post things died down a lot. Sometimes when I talk or post about such experiences they seem to suddenly go away. Coincidence? It’s funny, sometimes I wonder if it’s all imagination. The only tangible things that are real evidence that my practice is really “doing anything” are increased peace and overall acceptance of situations and such, and definate sexual response, especially just after practice, which is sort of hard to deal with as I don’t necessarily want to awaken sexual desire at this time. I’m still a newbie with all this, just over a year under my belt. I guess it could take some time before this kundalini is free to travel.
Thanks for writing, Alan
Hi Kirtanman,
in running too fast on the one end, and too slow on the other, it is only now that I read the sequel of your posts and your question: how to know when things are really too tough.
In my own experience over the last weeks, I would say I personally am going from fragile wonder to sheer almost hopelessness and despair from the heavy seriousness of it all. I guess -pacing up and down- needs some techniques, at the right time. I guess when all comes down to it we’re intuitively led to the answers or the questions.
As in the questions are the answer and the answers are the question, what next?
As in the past equals not the future, but how to bind the timing of the future together?
on both an individual as well as a more colletivized yet not too collectivized basis. It depends on the level and the time. It is SOOOOOO difficult, I cant even begin to explain my current experiences between exstacy and yes, one word that you used, almost giving up. (many times per day…)
Interestingly enough I found some original cd’s with Indian music / mantra’s back tonight: one of the mails in this thread was signed with Kumar and at the same time I found a few cd’s back, one of them called SOUND SHAPES Music of the Mountins / Shiv Kumar Sharma - it cleared my mind instantly, and another one: Parallel Worlds, Mantra & Trancemusic “O Great Spirit” : i was all of a sudden able to actually get some WORK done with that music on the background, it equalizes the levels on the right level for clarity of mind (for me). Until of course I get muddeep into the routines of the past again when my courage sinks to below zero degrees again… and that is time for self pacng and stopping and doing something different. To me it starts to seem like this may have to continue for weeks still, hour after hour, each day a little more, no end in sight. Yet hopefully a more and more adjusted participation mystique or something.
From the point of the view of sheer desperation and needing some mental clarity back, these cd’s were, at the right time, what I would call life saving. So what you are saying is that things need to be handled less carefully and more forcefully? I get so destructive if I do, according to some. Yet at the same time there are different things evolving.
One of the interesting things for me to work through in my own karma/dharma rubbish, is the problem of Cancer, both in astrology, as well as healthwise.
I seem to develop an allergy and absolute panick at the most sensitive times, to do with people who think they care about me, yet do not know who I am. Even if they are family (having lost my own id anyway, I dont even know who I am, I know who I was and what I wish to be, yet I do not know who I am, unless I place myself in a situation of relationship.
On the crownlevel or baselevelor heartlevel level it is incredibly difficult to distinguish relationship-issues with the external world, on one level it is so, on another it is not, as we enter the past and the future together.
I think we need to keep one another sane via this group effort.
For one of the other things which involve enlightenment is the darkness of the void, the being sucked back in into panick and fear. Love seems to arouse hatred. In very sensitive/sensitized times as these, I just can hardly deal with the junk I get in my email systems, I have just given up on the externals more or less, where that is concerned, and focus on getting myself sorted out.
But I can’t do it alone…
Thanks for your mails.
“yoginstar”
Hi Kirtanman,
As you asked if the beginning of the opening of your crown chakra meant that realization was immanent…
I recently found this on the internet:
It’s from this site:
http://www.lightandlife.com/new/healing_fields/Brown-Chakra7.htm
Looks like that could answer your question. And yes, it looks like you are right on the edge of something BIG… or NOTHING AT ALL, depending on how Zen/ Advaita you want to be about your angle on Freedom .
Christi.
Hi Christi,
Thanks very much - and timely answer (my crown has just started “kicking in” again, big time! Tingly sensations, a bit of heat - but mostly a major increase in daily ecstasy – I was experiencing orders-of-magnitude increased levels of ecstatic conductivity leading to savikalpa samadhi, just sitting around the house, this evening!
In my sadhana (and I am truly ultra-grateful for this) samadhi is not uncommon - it is essentially experienced every sitting-practices sessions … the “spontaneous onset” was the unusual part.
Ditto the significantly greater ecstasy - and I wasn’t doing anything to “spur it on” – except breathe!
And, in all seriousness: I have no idea how “close” I might be to major realization - but incrementally increasing sense of greater awareness (tangible awareness … not “Hm, I think this may be different” - it’s different!!) of Oneness … I was (literally) realizing oneness with cigarette butts (and everything else in my perceptual field, at the time … the oneness just seemed, and felt … self-evident.)
It really is like an inside-out feeling change.
It’s wild (and awesome!)
And I’ll keep everyone (literally) posted, of course!
Other sypmtoms include lot of Spontaneous Tongue Kriyas (that’s either a kundalini symptom, or a great band name …! 
) - my tongue will often flop around like a trout with a bad case of hemorrhoids - which I can control as needed (i.e. “in public” ), but otherwise … I just let it dance; it obviously wants to … for the most part, it flicks around the 1st/2nd chakra energy points near the lips and gums, and then flies back into full kechari for a moment or two … kinda cool, and very interesting!
And I’m beginning to understand that Khechari may not be exactly as important as it is emphasized in this forum.
It appears, rather, that Khechari may be infinitely more important - than can accurately be conveyed in words … though, to their credit, the Hatha Yoga Pradapikas at least try:
(54) There is only one germ of evolution, and that is 0m; there is only one mudra: khecari; only one duty: to become independent from everything; and only one spiritual state [avastha]: deep meditation [mano-mani].
http://www.yoga-age.com/pradipika/part3.html
The information on that pages conveys how the ancients (of many cultures) did their best to communicate the importance of Khechari Mudra (please note: I’m using properly transliterated Sanskrit spelling of the term, for easier / better Googling).
I’ve been studying a bit more Kabbalah, lately - and it’s essentially Yoga in mystical Jewish clothing. The story of Moses in an illustration (once we understand that the Pharaoh is the ego, Egypt is the body, the Red Sea are the waters/etheric plane (emotional lives) which the leading subtle energy traversing the spine … can take us beyond.
In Kabbalah, they teach that the seas didn’t part right away … but the waters rose to the noses of the Israelites - and when they drew (what they thought was their final) breath - air overcame water, as it always does in yoga.
Then Moses climbed the mountain (spine) and spoke with the burning bush (the brilliant, bush-like vision which many of us experience when certain aspects of kundalini ignite). Moses came back down “transfigured” alright … but not by a deity outside himself … simply by his own yogically evolved neurophysiology.
http://72.14.209.104/search?q=cache:PgRppBxGyZoJ:lnc.usc.edu/~brannon/pranayama/YaJ_msword.doc+moses+symbolizes+tongue+khechari&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=4&gl=us
(Kind of a long, funky link … but it should still work, hopefully - good “Moses as Yogi” and “Ancient Kabbalists Knew a Thing or Two About Yoga” info.
And as far as how advaitically or not I’m experiencing all of this – I think a lot of that discussion is tough, due to semantics.
Advaitists will say “no where to go, and nothing to do” – and they mean “to be in enlightenment”, and so they’re right.
However, most sadhakas (and Adyashanti acknowledged this repeatedly, as mentioned in some of my other posts) feel that practices can help you get there. They just don’t have anything to do with being there.
Enlightened advaitists (like Adya) are just being very, very literal … the airplane that flew you to Brazil, doesn’t have anything to do with being in Brazil.
True … and possibly an important point, lest people start becoming convinced that practices x, y and j are the holy practices which result in enlightenment, etc. etc.
In my own experience with both advaita and yoga, AYP seems to be like a nice, new comfortable lear jet … it may not be the only way to get to Brazil, and it may have nothing to to with being in Brazil … but of all the vehicles which might get me there … this little lear jet is not bad at all!
And to clarify - Advaitists don’t advocate denial of experience, unless they deeply misunderstand - so a major awakening wouldn’t be experienced as Nothing … that comes later when “All as One” is realized even more deeply as “All as Nothing”.
Again, semantics has a lot to do with it Advaitists say that all except Brahman (the Absolute) is illusory, because all but Brahman is transitory, and ultimately dissolves along with space-time … but we don’t (bodies do, true self doesn’t) - because we are as unborn / undying as any instance of pure consciousness can be.
I find the word “apparent” helps a lot. I may understand that philosophical, the material universe is one, but if there’s an apparent bus bearing down on me, I’ll probably move. “Unreal” doesn’t mean the bus is a figment of imagination - it means that it’s nature and structure - its namarupa - its name and form - is transient, and therefore illusory.
It’s like with computer systems … we’re discussing whether or not desktop icons are real, and the sages are telling us the the applications (software) layer is yet more real, and the Operating System level, more real than that … and in the ultimate, causal plane … we can do just a little … and effect a lot, on the physical plane … almost everything here is pure effect (including you and me - Ahamkara - ego, if often thought to be the projector … when it it actually part of the projection.)
I’m really not a philosophy / concepts guy … I’m a “what describes the way things are, most accurately and clearly” - and for me, advaita and other non-dual models do this very well.
Essentially debating (and I’m not referring to you, but to any of is) isn’t going to help our sadhana - I recommened simply remaining open to a given teacher and his teachings, and see if they resonate with you.
Personally, I would never formally describe myself as an Advaitin, any more than I would call myself a Tantrika, or whatever … those label are either restrictive, or a waste of air, I find.
Love thy neighbor as thyself, doing sitting practices twice a day - and before long, you won’t have to ask or tell anything - except to those you naturally attract to you, to teach, and to learn with together.
Peace & Namaste,
Kirtanman
Hi Kirtanman:
Great reminder!
With openness comes the receptivity to receiving from all. Then we learn and receive much. Even from the gentle swaying of a tree, the care-free drifting of the puffs of clouds over the deep blue beyond, the silent echo of our footsteps into the bosom of the earth, as we forge on to our own unknowing.
Welcome to Georgia.
BRV.
Hi Kirtanman,
Thanks for another wonderful post.
Yes, that seems to be the great thing about the crown… as it opens and we merge into it, we enter samadhi spontaneously wherever we are.
I get this too. The breath carries prana (maybe it is mostly prana?) so when the system is open and ecstatic, simply breathing into it will increase the ecstacsy many times.
That’s interesting. I don’t practice kechari mudra, and yet our expriences in many ways, in terms of AYP practice seem to be very similar.
Maybe Yoga is Kabala in mystical Indian clothing? Kabala certainly seems to have certain depths that yoga does not have, and vise-versa. It is definately worth a look in terms of understanding the whole picture. As is Sufism.
That’s what I meant by “whichever angle we take on it”. As I see it, Advaita and Dvaita are really just two different angles on the same thing. Not so different really, just viewpoints.
Semantics do make discussion about Advaita difficult. But it is still really beautifull, and hopefully useful. Personally I find that the more my crown opens, the more of it makes sense, and the more I can see that everyone is right (each of us coming from our own perspective).
And then later still as “All as nothing and everything, eternally flowing into and out of Being”. 
Well, I don’t know if I agree. I find a great deal can be gained by discussion and debate. It helps us to clear up areas where our knowledge is cloudy, or simply mistaken. Another great advantage is that sometimes we get our buttons pushed . Certainly not a bad thing. Adyashanti I believe said that having all his buttons pushed was a major aspect of his awakening. All those buttons have to go! 
But more importantly, I am finding that contemplating the advaita teachings (and the discussions on this forum have helped me imensely with that) is becoming one door on entering samadhi in daily life. Bringing my attention to the crown as it opens is the other door.
Sounds beautiful!
Love and Light
Christi
You’re very welcome; thanks for the kind words!
Sounds that way, I agree.
My guess is: we’ve both apparently had similar success in cultivating ecstatic conductivity, and opening applicable channels, purifying our systems overall, etc. — though we should both probably be careful not to presume too much similarity (simply because we don’t know, and there’s likely a whole lotta individuality to each of our sadhana / experience, as well).
I do agree, though, that we seem to have quite a bit of similarity, per several posts we’ve each written / read, where the similarities are evident.
Once I “attained khechari” in AYP terms (Stage 2), I did notice a linear (and very powerful) increase in both ecstatic conductivity and inner silence - though I had a pretty good “running start” with both.
I’m still a very, very early stage “Khecharin” though – so time and practice will tell.
Personally, I see it kind of like:
Yogic literature claims “A” is true … “check” (I’ve experienced “A”) … Yogic literature claims “B” is true … “check” (I’ve experienced “B”) … Yogic literature claims “C” is true … “check” (I’ve experienced “C”) … {so on and so forth, ipso facto, yadda-yadda} …
… Yogic literature claims “H” is true … “check” (I’ve experienced “H”) …
So mayyyybe (just maybe), by the time I get to (say) … “K” (for “Khechari Mudra, Ultimate Freakin’ Importance Thereof”) …
I will find that the aforementioned claims made by our good buddies, the rishi-editors of the Hatha Yoga Pradapika, not to mention a certain modern teacher of similar information (let’s call him … “Yogani” … ) … concerning Khechari (Vedic Sanskrit for “sticking your tongue up your nose from the inside” ) Mudra … are also true.
So, seriously - it’s a fairly strong matter of literal faith for me … but, also … the experiment literally continues.
My hypothesis / guess is that the Hatha Yoga Pradapika quote will prove to be essentially accurate, because (in my relatively limited experience … compared to, say … Patanjali, or Vyasa, or Shankaracharya, etc.) - yogic literature doesn’t seem to emphasize anything that strongly, without having a fairly powerful reason behind it … even if “said reason” is a symbol / pointer.
My guess as to the reason is:
Yogic practices initiate and facilitate what essentially amounts to a second puberty … literal, neurophysiological changes in the body-mind system, which allow it to act as a more powerful receiver than we ever realized is possible.
We’re born thinking that not only can we only pick up “AM-band radio” … we think-feel / are conditioned that we’re not only a single AM-band radiostation (“All KTMN - all the time! 98.6 on my bio-dial!” - but that we’re also the radio receiver box-unit thingy, to boot!
“What’s that, doctor? My battery is going?? Nooooo!!! Please - isn’t there anything you can do?! Dammit! I knew I shouldnt’ve left my ‘rewind’ button pressed down for the last four decades!”
Then the battery dies, and all the other radios gather 'round and cry, and sing, and stick the broken radio-guy or radio-gal in a hole in the ground, or burn it … and then go emotionally all wiggy on each other, because this reinforces their belief that we’re both the station and the box-unit thingy … and so it goes …
And the “radio” who “died” is going, “Hey, check it out … I’m FM-band now … hey, can’t anyone hear me??”
And some old yogi or kabbalist or whatever says, “Can I hear you? Oy! My dear departed rabbi-guru dude could hear you, and he’s Satellite Radio, now, or is that Internet Radio … whatever … pipe down, and relax … you’ll be re-broadcast in about … 48 days or so …!”
And so it goes, until we can perceive (“be the receiver for the broacasts from”) AM and FM, Satellite and Internet … until we get it … I’m not any of those things … I’m the signal … the amplitude and modulation … no, wait … I mean … the 1s and the 0s, and the … electricity …
… but the 1 is just a pulse of the electricity … and the 0 is just the relative absence thereof … so all there is, is the electricity … and the space-void infiniternity in which it occurs …
And all the broadcast bands are just more subtle … or more coarse … means to … communicate …
{And yes, my oh-so-entertaining analogy breaks down, in the sense that to carry the analogy … AM-band and its radio sets, and FM-band and its radio sets, and Satellite band with its … type of receivers … and Internet radio with its … network diagram … idea-ish almost-thoughts … would each be on their own “plane” of consciousness / broadcast.
As In: Physical bodies are physical-plane receiving units, astral bodies are astral-plane receiving units, and so on …
Yoga enables us to become a … stereo system … with … Windows Media Center … (Quick … somebody … stop me before I analogize again …! )
(Hey, if Elron Hubbard can come up with Scientology, why can’t I come up with … Radiology …!)
{So Ducking}
Partially agreed … I’d say it’s more like:
Kabbalah is Jewish Yoga.
And not meaning to disagree - just going by my own partial awareness of the history / timing and geography involved.
There seems to be a general westward flow, emanating out of India - and there’s a lot of very clear “sub-setting” going on … Hebrew (and its alphabet <– oh-so literally … that English word comes from “Alef” & “Bet” … the first two letters of the Hebrew … writing system) are clearly a subset of Sanskrit and Devanagari (some did a study … “Google is our friend” if anyone is interested … that the Hebrew Alphabet is simply Devanagari with some of the doohickeys chopped off, and the top bar thingy erased).
(Did I ever tell you I’m a highly trained linguist? Good. Because I’m certainly not. )
Hans Jenny did those cryo-whatcha-callit … cryogenics experiments, wherein (among other things, namely jaggedy, coarse noises make jaggedy, coarse patterns in metal shavings, and sweet, saccharin sounds make sweet, saccharin patterns in metal shavings) it was discovered that when the letters of Sanskrit are spoken aloud …
… that the metal shavings form the letters in Devanagari.
And that when the letters of the Hebrew language are spoken aloud …
… that the metal shavings form the letters in Hebrew.
And, let’s see, the other languages where this happens …
… don’t exist.
Those were the only two.
Yes, really.
Remember Abraham and Sarah, in the Old Testament?
Or rather, (a)Brahma(m) and Sara(swati)?
HmmmMMMMmmMMMMmmmmm …
And far be it from me, though - to say that Kabbalah is derivative (I’m emphatically not saying that … very seriously) - just that the cultural, linguistic, historical (who did what, first) and geo-directional flow was more “India > Middle East”, than “Middle East > India”.
However, all the esoteric wisdom traditions seem to offer highly accurate and complete mystical-esoteric maps … whether we’re talking about Yoga / Sanatana Dharma, Kabbalah / Judaism, Sufism / Islam, Gnostic-Mystical Christianity / Christianity, Western Mysticism / Other Western Spiritual Systems, Quantum Physics / Physics, or whatever.
There’s even a commensurate movement in psychology and neuroscience, per the work of folks like Hameroff (Stuart), Penrose (Roger), Pert (Candace), Wolinksy (Stephen) & Lipton (Bruce), et. al.
Ultimately, it’s a matter of what will get us “there” (aka Here … ) - and all the major esoteric and mystical traditions, ranging from Yoga and Kabbalah, to Sufism, Esoteric Christianity, Taoism and Tantric traditions (both Sanatana Dharma and Buddhism based) - have certainly proven their worth … as well as their potential pitfalls.
It seems to be mostly a matter of how bad we want it (per Krishna’s comment to Arjuna when they were riding around in that chariot that only “one in a thousand” would ultimately make it “unto Me” (Lord Krishna, aka Reality) – Bhakti / Earnestness / Grace seems to be the great dividing / deciding factor (fuel) …
… with wisdom, awareness (Jnana / Gnosticism) being the steering wheel-slash-map reading …
… and practices … being the accelerator-stepping par excellence …
All three components (devotion, wisdom, action) seem to be necessary … and all mystical systems seem to supply opportunity therefore, in sufficient quantity … as long as we bring those things, in sufficient quantity, as well …
I don’t disagree (and not back-peddling … it’s just another semantics thing … )— discussion can be quite good, and clarifying … I was referring more to “down in the dirt” egoic argu-bating – which I don’t think too many of us engage in …
… but there’s kind of a “second-tier” (not arguing exactly, but discussions that unproductively devolve to a level where sitting and breathing presently would likely do more good …) IF ya know what I mean …
As In:
Good, productive discussion can be useful … as can (but of course! ) seemingly endless but hopefully amusing and/or somewhat informative mega-posts …) —
But there’s a “talk, talk, talk” and “me, right - you, wrong” dynamic that has been popping up here and there at the Forum, that I think I was feeling extra-sensitive to, on the day I wrote that (“less talk, more practice”) sentiment.
I don’t think too many of “us regulars” have gone there – not too much, at least …
… but I thought the “talk is secondary to practice” sentiment was worth mentioning - at least then.
However - again - productive, loving aware dialog – can be a key and useful part of the Jnana-Gnostic (aka Steering ) portion of (each of) our sadhana, in my opinion (and experience; I find value in it, too - fer shure! )
Thanks!
Yeah … that was one of those “Whoa, where’d that come from??” things …
It’s cool when then happens (not in an “I did that” sense, but in a “Life did that” sense! )
And …
… I am officially existential toast. Not to mention hungry.
I would say “peace out”, but it’s more like …
Peace In,
Kirtanman
Love and Light
Christi
Hi Kirtanman,
Something funny seems to be happening with the quote facility, so it looks like I wrote some of your last post, in several places… maybe you could edit it and reset the quote markups?
Christi
More like *my" quote facility … but thanks for your diplomacy …
“On it”.
Peace & Namaste,
Kirtanman
PS – Just did it … though am bone-tired, so no promises … (as to quality of quote-facility). I think “who said what” is cleared up, but not certain (I actually came across a couple of sentences, where I wasn’t sure if they were mine or yours … kinda cool, in a way … )
Hi Kirtanman,
Thanks for clearing that up.
It’s always good to blame the computer when you can… that’s the best thing about computers
Hey, the same thing happened to me! You know what they say about one universal mind… ? Or was it one universal heart? I never did pay much attention at school.
From my own incredibly partial awareness of these things, I’m not so sure. Aparently the Arians entered India thousands of years ago from the West, driving the original Dravidians east and south. The Aryans (meaning Noble ones) brought the Sanskrit language with them. Originally they settled around the Indus valley area. The sanskrit language obviously has it’s roots in mysticism (it’s basically just a spiritual language from start to finish) as ancient Hebrew is. So I don’t think in terms of Mysticism spreading from ancient India outwards, but rather entering India from a much older tradition based around the middle east. So who came before the Aryans in terms of civilizations, that have an obvious incredible mystical knowledge, and could have influenced the later Aryans? I don’t know. But I have heard that there were incredible civilizations around the middle east/ northern Africa area even before the Egyptian empire. These civilizations apparently sprang up overnight with advanced written languages, and advanced knowledge of astrology and astronomy just as the Aryans had. We have archeological evidence of the existence of these civilizations and evidence of their advanced knowledge.
Before that we have to rely on channeled information… Atlantis? … Lemuria? As a true investigative scientist, I don’t rule any possibilities out. 
Christi
Hey Christi,
Just FYI, the whole “Aryan Invasion Slander” thing has recently been cleared up, thanks to a balanced application of new technology, and well-applied critical thanking.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rY4Q2xx7BTc
I stand by yoga>kabbalah hypothesis - but like you, am open to the truth, whatever it may be. And, quite honestly, I don’t have any egoic ties to yoga coming first, historically … makes no difference to me. It just seems to me that that’s the way it is, based on my own review of all available info. Regardless, I highly recommend viewing the video at the link given above; it helps to shed some significant light on the culture which gave us the science of yoga.
Peace & Namaste,
Kirtanman
Thanks for that link. The video was really interesting to watch.
Shiva.
Hi Kirtanman,
Thanks for the video link. It is very interesting. I should mention though that although many claims were made in the video to scientific proof, I saw very little evidence to actually back up the claims they were making. Maybe they didn’t have time to include all (or any) of the scientific evidence in the video.
But still, it would be interesting to know what really happened… maybe we’ll have to wait for an expert on ancient civilization and the migration of mystical knowledge to join the forum… or maybe there is already one among us…?
What was it again? oh yea… Seek first the kingdom of heaven within…
Christi
p.s Thanks for all your other amazing video links, some of them really blew me away (literally 
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Kirtanman,
This post you made is quite old now. I wondered how things were for you now?
My head feels like it is inside a toaster! and it wants to get out like one side of the brain is one slice of toast and the other side is the other slice of toast! I don’t believe putting attention anywhere near the head region like with spinal breathing will help at all.
I want to know what all the grounding exercises are. Anyone?